Where did it go wrong?: Cadillac XLR

"LJ909" (lj909) 10/17/2015 at 15:27 • Filed to: None

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A Cadillac hard top roadster with edgy Art & Science styling based on the Corvette? How could Cadillac mess up a formula that had success written all over it? Sadly they did though

Look at that drab horrible interior. Is that the interior befitting an 86-110 thousand dollar roadster? No, it isnt. That was pretty much the main complaint with the XLR. The quality wasnt up to par. Not only that, many people werent ready for a Cadillac costing this much.

Turn of the century Cadillac had no business selling a car costing this much at the time. Thats why over the course of its 8 year production they only sold a little over 15 thousand. Honestly though I wouldnt mind owning one of these now. What other things about it made it fail besides the high price and terrible quality?

PS9 > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 15:34

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This car’s whole problem is that the C6 is better. Looks better, sounds better, better aftermarket support...it was the better option. The only thing it had over the C6 was the folding metal hardtop, but the folks who care for that sort of thing were never going to pick a caddy over an SL anyway.

The interiors are the same, but that worked against the XLR, because it’s supposed to be a complete cut above plebian brands like Chevy. But in this case...it wasn’t. Everyone knew they were just better off with the Chevy, so that’s what they went and brought.

Supreme Chancellor and Glorious Leader SaveTheIntegras > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 15:37

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this

Nick > PS9 10/17/2015 at 15:39

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i loved the look of the XLR, but wasn’t it also more expensive than the C6? according to wikipedia, the 2009 XLR had an MSRP of $89K, which was the cheapest. it debuted with an MSRP of $110k

Nibby > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 15:43

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If I’m paying over $70,000 for a luxury tourer, it better not have fake wood and cheap plastics galore.

CaptDale - is secretly British > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 15:52

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Because the Northstar is in it

PS9 > Nick 10/17/2015 at 15:55

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And there’s the problem; 320HP for $90k, or 400HP from the same sort of car for $50k. What is that extra $40k buying you? It’s certainly not luxury given the chintzy interiors they gave these things.

But the XLRV fixes the power problem for $110k!...oh wait, the Corvette got a vastly improved LS3 in the same year that makes only 5HP less in the base model! And let’s not even talk about the 200MPH z06 that still MSRPd for $35k less....

In 2005, they wanted as much for an XLR as you would pay for an SL600 . You just have to wonder what was going on in GM at the time to think the business case for this car in the state it was in existed at all...

LongbowMkII > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 15:56

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to be fair all early 2000s luxury interiors have aged horribly

C62030 > LongbowMkII 10/17/2015 at 16:03

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Not just luxury.

LongbowMkII > PS9 10/17/2015 at 16:04

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you only need a few people to pay 100k for a 50k car before it all starts making sense.

samssun > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 16:09

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Price alone. The first CTS had just come out so the Cadillac revolution was just getting started. Not bad for one of their first turnaround cars. At 60-65k base, 75-80k V, they would’ve sold like hotcakes. 90/110 was just way too steep.

Steve in Manhattan > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 16:16

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I’ve never even seen one in the wild. A wasted opportunity.

DoYouEvenShift > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 16:28

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Too expensive and underpowered.

Chariotoflove > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 17:19

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Is that silver paint on the interior?

Birddog > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 17:41

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It failed because there was absolutely no market for it. I don’t care what “Research” showed. The only people I knew that bought these were “Old Cadillac” people. The people that would have a Fleetwood Brougham that they bought new in the driveway. The people Cadillac was (and still is) desperately trying to get away from.

Cadillac never needed a halo car. All the time and money poured into the XLR could have been better used elsewhere.

El Rivinado > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 17:46

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I think in order to realize why this car failed, we have to look at a similar car that proceeded it.

The Cadillac Allante. Now, for the record, I like the Allante, I think it’s a cool car and that it’s a design that still holds up and looks beautiful to this day. However, the Allante was a flawed mess, from it’s leaky roofs that plagued some models, to the craptacular and slow as shit HT4100 engine that “graced” it in its first year. Couple that with a very high price (nearly 60k in 1993, it’s final year) and it was just doomed to fail. Even when it got the Northstar in 93 it was too late and went back to the GM adage of “finally get it right then kill it off due to poor sales from the first screw-ups”

The XLR does have some advantages over the Allante, the RWD setup being the big one, but it was let down by one fatal flaw. It was Corvette sourced.

Say what you want about the Allante, but GM was at least smart in giving the car it’s own platform to really accentuate the image they wanted for it, the best thing you could say is that the lack of platform sharing helped to differentiate it and become its own thing.

But, GM made the big mistake of not only putting it on a Corvette platform, but also giving it less power, no manual option, and making it more expensive. No one was going to pony up for a slower Corvette based roadster just because it said Cadillac on the hood (there was also no way in hell that it was ever going to be able to compete with the Mercedes SL or the Jaguar XK on being a luxury cruiser because at that point, Cadillac’s brand cachet wasn’t what it used to be and no one looking at either of these cars would consider a Cadillac as a serious option.)

Add in the fact that the design was a bit off (This is all just personal opinion, but I really am not a fan of the Art and Science design, and I think compared to the Allante, the XLR looks like it crashed into glass sculpture shop) and you just have a recipe for disaster, and even with the XLR-V, it just highlighted the old GM problem of getting the car right, and then killing it because of poor sales from the first screw-up.

So there you have it, it’s just the Allante 2.0 in terms of function and story, unlike the Allante though, I have a hard time believing it'll develop a cult following.

LJ909 > CaptDale - is secretly British 10/17/2015 at 17:47

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Nah. Everyone knows the Northstar was an excellent engine. GM just left it to languish.

LJ909 > LongbowMkII 10/17/2015 at 17:48

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That is true. Especially the American stuff.

LJ909 > samssun 10/17/2015 at 17:49

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Yea. They tried to be an American Mercedes SL with the price and the hardtop. People werent ready for that then. Now, MAYBE.

LJ909 > Steve in Manhattan 10/17/2015 at 17:50

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They actually are lookers in person. The design on them has aged pretty well.

LJ909 > Chariotoflove 10/17/2015 at 17:50

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Knowing pre bankruptcy GM, probably.

Steve in Manhattan > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 17:54

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I recall that the Allante looked good, the Reatta did not.

LJ909 > Birddog 10/17/2015 at 17:54

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Pretty good point. Buyers of this were either old Cadillac, usually seniors like you said, or what I call people with poser, douchbag bro money. Those are what I call the people that had an Escalade ESV in the driveway on 22 in spinners ( we are talking last decade here) and got this for their wife.

LongbowMkII > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 18:01

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meh, ugh, dated but otherwise decent

LJ909 > El Rivinado 10/17/2015 at 18:02

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your exactly right. I think your right about it being the Allante 2.0. No one would ever admit that though. But I dont think your right about it shouldnt have been based on the Vette. I think that saved the XLR from being an even bigger disaster. If they had developed a platform specific for this car, (which mind you only sold maybe barley over 1000 in some years) it would have been way more expensive. They could have used the Kappa platform, but I think that was way to small for what they were going for. The Corvette platform was the only way to go I think. How they got that wrong though I have no idea.

holdenbacktears > LongbowMkII 10/17/2015 at 18:13

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Merc looks very nice still, happy to spend many hours in there

LongbowMkII > holdenbacktears 10/17/2015 at 18:15

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I’m sure that they’re all perfectly comfortable, but aesthetically? we disagree.

El Rivinado > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 18:19

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While I agree that putting it on the Vette platform would be the only way it could work, I also feel like it would always warrant comparisons to the Vette in numerous ways. “Why am I paying this much when I can get a Corvette for cheaper? Why does this have an Automatic when I can get a Corvette with a stick? Why does this make less horsepower when the Corvette makes more?” Etc. Etc. Etc. It would always be viewed as inferior to it’s cheaper, purpose built cousin rather than be viewed on it’s own merits or lackthereof. The Allante lived and died on it’s own merits and failings, the XLR would always be compared to its platform mate.

But, it would also be the only way this car could work. like Bart Simpson says, "Well, you're damned if you do. And you're damned if you don't."

V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches > LongbowMkII 10/17/2015 at 18:54

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Eh...

V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches > holdenbacktears 10/17/2015 at 18:55

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Believe me, it is

Chariotoflove > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 20:31

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That looked cheap even on my Mazda.

911e46z06 > LJ909 10/17/2015 at 22:22

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I think a nice XLR-V will be worth about a billion dollars in 20 years or so.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > LongbowMkII 10/18/2015 at 00:00

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But in the American offerings the problem isn’t so much how it looks, it’s how it FEELS.

Carbon Fiber Sasquatch > LJ909 10/18/2015 at 01:03

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The reason it failed is simple, no V12. Without it’s own, vastly more powerful engine, why buy it over a Vette?

“Here’s my more expensive, less powerful Cadillac version of a Corvette!”

It’s a miracle they sold any at all really. All they needed to do was put the Z06 engine in the base model and make an 8.5L LS12 engine (based off the LS6) in the XLR-V. Ultimate American grand tourer, interior be damned!

LJ909 > Carbon Fiber Sasquatch 10/18/2015 at 01:05

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Good idea, but I wouldnt trust or touch a V12 from GM of that era if someone paid me too, if it ever existed. They should have done more to differentiate it from its Vette roots though. Like making a unique Northstar V8 that was unique only to the XLR, and doing better with that interior.

Carbon Fiber Sasquatch > LJ909 10/18/2015 at 01:12

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Meh, the LS engines are pretty bullet-proof, they would have figured it out.

But the main point to remember is that they were selling these damned things for Corvette ZR1 money; if you had a little over $100k to burn on an American sports/GT car, which would you rather have in your driveway??

Axial > LJ909 10/18/2015 at 04:11

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Summarily:

Polarizing exterior, low quality interior, and a suspension that was way too soft and couldn’t handle corners as well as its Chevrolet cousin.

Also down on power.

The XLR-V was what the base XLR should’ve been in terms of power and handling. Nothing simple is going to save the interior.

Axial > Steve in Manhattan 10/18/2015 at 04:18

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What? Nooooo. Reatta was a better looking car. There was a certain charm to the early, pre-Northstar Allanté, but the Reatta has aged more gracefully.

Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight > Nibby 10/19/2015 at 03:17

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The wood is real and exotic. There is very little plastic that’s not covered in leather.

Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight > Chariotoflove 10/19/2015 at 03:20

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No, its a soft aluminum with a carbon fiber-style design.

Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight > LJ909 10/19/2015 at 04:30

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As the owner of this beast called ELWOOD, its hard not to defend ownership of this car to you; on the street, it gets rave reviews for the timeless design.

I keep hearing terrible quality, soft ride, and the like, but having owned it 5 years now... I don’t see it. The quality of the design and materials is better than the vette. It was envisined not to compete with the vette, but as an alternative highway cruiser based on the same chassis. Therefore, it didn’t need more power with interstate speed limits at 55; it is way more comfortable on road trips than any vette because of the softer ride; by the time these were made the Northstar motor was proven efficient and reliable. The technology integration in the car was ahead of its time, the C7 Corvette is the closest they’ve come since.

Sharing the C6 platform was a windfall for me! I’ve owned vettes and remember how raw and brutish they can be. What I wanted was a more unique and refined design that I could take to the opera on Tuesday and race on Wednesday. So my V is heavily modified. C6 Zr1 front springs and sway bars, Z06 rear springs and sway bars; 510RWHP/540RWTQ; headers and 3” Billy Boat Fusion cat-back exhaust from C6 Z06; 9 1/2” wide wheels with 265/18 front, 285/18 rear Pilot Sport Cups on C6Z06 wheels.

Yes its the world’s quickest and fastest stock block XLR, but ELWOOD is also a show car because they aren’t often “seen in the wild.” Its also my daily driver (as long as its not winter - gotta do mods sometime). So far I’ve averaged 18000 miles per year; an autocross championship, 3 land speed records, and a 1/4 mile time that I’ll admit scared me - 11.7@128.

There is no such thing as a perfect car. You can find faults with all of them sooner or later. I think ELWOOD is a good fit for my personality and lifestyle. So I’m just having fun with it and will probably never sell it!

Chariotoflove > Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight 10/19/2015 at 09:50

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Well,if it's real aluminum, I feel much better about it. It looked a bit like the plastic in my Mazda that gets scratched and is obviously plastic.

Chariotoflove > Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight 10/19/2015 at 09:54

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I’m glad you said this. I get tired of readers and auto journalists calling cars equivalent because they share a platform and then concluding with, “so why not just get the cheaper X?” This is not just a more expensive corvette.

LJ909 > Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight 10/19/2015 at 12:00

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I am impressed sir. Much respect to you. I’ve always loved the XLR. Matter of fact I’ve been looking at them for sale on Auto Trader the last few days. I just think though that alot of people have problems with it because they expect it to be something its not so maybe your right about one thing: its not a Cadillac Corvette. Its something totally different. A Crusier.

Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight > Chariotoflove 10/19/2015 at 12:33

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The problem is.... it ain’t carbon fiber! When I say soft, I mean I dented it with my class ring when reaching for my coffee in the cup holder. Now that’s just a bad design decision. I wish it had been carbon fiber, that would have looked great in there with the Zebrano wood.

Chariotoflove > Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight 10/19/2015 at 13:13

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That’s a shame. No way to fix it short of total replacement.

Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight > Chariotoflove 10/19/2015 at 13:17

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Yeah, I could have responded as a zealot and tried to rebuff every individual post in this thread, but that’s not me. Everyone’s entitled to their opinion. Maybe, I should open an AMA for the car over on the Cadillac Corner blog. What do you think?

Chariotoflove > Gizmo - The Only Good Gremlin, but don't feed me after Midnight 10/19/2015 at 13:25

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Yeah, why not? It’s become so traditional to bash on Cadillacs of that period, I bet many have forgotten the actually good and bad and the context.

CaptDale - is secretly British > LJ909 10/19/2015 at 13:34

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I didn’t say it is a bad engine, but they have midblock issues and honestly not enough power for that car. There should have been an LS in it, plain and simple.